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Re: What does 'run' do in cperl-mode?


From: Xah Lee
Subject: Re: What does 'run' do in cperl-mode?
Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 15:09:06 -0700 (PDT)
User-agent: G2/1.0

On Jul 28, 2:31 pm, Ted Zlatanov <address@hidden> wrote:
> On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 13:28:19 -0700 (PDT)XahLee<address@hidden> wrote:
>
> XL> On Jul 28, 12:57 pm, Ted Zlatanov <address@hidden> wrote:>> On Mon, 28 
> Jul 2008 08:02:09 -0700 (PDT)XahLee<address@hidden> wrote:
>
> XL> The cost of changing emacs's notation from “M-‹key›” to “Alt+‹key›” in
> XL> emacs's manual is about maybe 4 hour's work by a few interactive find-
> XL> replace operations in emacs, helped with eye balling.
>
> XL> There is basically no cost to users. Any new user will immediately
> XL> understand “Alt+‹key›” and perhaps feel this is a great improvement.
> XL> Old emacs users might get a mental shock for the first hour when their
> XL> hear about this change in emacs 23's change log, that's about it. Same
> XL> for “C-” vs “Ctrl+” notation.
>
>
>
> >> OK, since you're not even remotely connected to reality, I'll drop this
> >> topic.
>
> XL> I tried to answer your question.
>
> If you think the cost is 4 hours of work and none to the users, I think
> you're disconnected from reality (or have no experience writing manuals,
> software, and doing user support).



Huh?

What exactly is your reason? What exactly is your argument about my
paragraph? You have to give explicit reason to disagree. You cannot
simply say i'm disconnected from reality. That makes no sense. Maybe
it is obvious to you. But i sincerely don't know what you are talking
about.


> >> You don't understand.  I am against this change (for reasons I listed),
> >> but I encourage you to submit it through the proper channels if you want
> >> to have any chance of making it happen.  Otherwise you're wasting
> >> everyone's time.
>
> XL> I'm aware you are against the change. I thought i answered your
> XL> question though. No need be rude ok? I tried not to.
>
> My point is that debating here is not going to make the change happen.
> If you feel strongly, propose the change and discuss it through the
> proper channels.  I am not being rude.



What makes you think that i think debating here a lot and change will
happen? And why you feel like needing to give me advice? Do you know
that giving unasked advice is insulting?

Can i teach you something too? The thing i want to teach is that, if
you want to drop a conversation, one effective way is to start by
yourself.


> XL> I have interest in discussion. You are the one first started the issue
> XL> about my use of the Alt+‹key› notation in this message:
> XL>http://groups.google.com/group/gnu.emacs.help/msg/e8592f0da7dec5e1?
>
> XL> I replied to answer your complain.
>
> It's not a complaint, it's a correction based on the Emacs manual.
>
> >> I go by what's in the Emacs manual.  You go by your opinion.  Which do
> >> you think is more useful to a user?
>
> XL> Emacs manual is written by people, and it solicits corrections and
> XL> suggestions.
>
> XL> Any manual, improves by corrections and suggestions. Books works that
> XL> way too. Many of the corrections and suggestions are from the readers,
> XL> such as you and me.
>
> I agree.  Make the suggestion through the proper channels; meanwhile
> let's keep using Meta when we help users (feel free to make a note that
> Alt is the default key bound to that modifier on most modern systems).
> Otherwise you're not helping users as much as you could, and you'll keep
> getting corrected.



O, so you want me to stap using the “Alt+‹key›” notation in
gnu.emacs.help, is that it?

I don't think you write very clearly. In the beginning of the thread,
when you wrote: «Please note that Alt is not the preferred prefix name
for Emacs
purposes.  It's Meta, abbreviated M (e.g. M-x), for two reasons: ...»

by that do you mean:

(1) just to let any newbie readers know that “Alt+‹key›” is not
emacs's conventional notation. “M-‹key›” is.

(2) Xah, you should stop using the “Alt+‹key›” notation in here.
Because that's misleading. If you must, please also mention that
“M-‹key›” is the emacs way.

(3) Xah, your “Alt+‹key›” is just incorrect.

What point are you making? A combination of them?

Now i have exchanged about 4 or 5 posts with you. In the beginning i
assumed you mean (3). Then, in your last message i thought you
actually means (1) and is very kind, just not a native English speaker
that's all. But now, it seems you mean (2), or all of the above.

What do you want? Why you telling me what to do?

If you want me to stop using “Alt+‹key›” in my post here, then, i'm
sorry, i cannot comply because you have no right.

If you think that my use “Alt+‹key›” is just totally wrong in the
context of emacs. Sorry, i disagree.

If you want to post a warning message everytime i used “Alt+‹key›”, so
that newbies understands that it is not emacs's conventional notation,
that's fine.

  Xah
∑ http://xahlee.org/

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