Re: [Phpgroupware-developers] Project Structure

[Dan Kuykendall]

Michael Dean wrote:

> Da Maniac! :)
>
> I also have followed the list and until recently was inactive in this
> project for an extended period of time.  I "left" the project after
> contributing schema_proc, MSSQL support (which still isn't quite there,
> but...), the way to implement bo/so/ui for applications, CreateObject,
> and maybe a few other things - but those are the important ones.

All your stuff is very cool.

> What made me leave in the end was then endless battle to bring something
> new to the architecture that could make it more robust, easier to work
> with and maintain, and be more scalable.  I simply grew tired of the
> arguments, mostly because the reasons and benefits for what I wanted to
> do were obvious to me, but not to others - and that communication
> difficulty was frustrating.  I recognize it wasn't 100% or even 60% the
> fault of who I was arguing with, but it was none the less frustrating.

LOL. As I remember I was one of your opposition. However I have seen the 
light of bo/so/ui and now live by that model. However, as I remember you 
were in a minority anyways, and would have lost by a vote in any case. 
The vote would simply be as wrong as I had been.

> So, I lingered on the dev lists, posting here and there (mostly when I
> felt the urge to voice my opinion about database related issues).  I've
> watched the volume of email from the fab four shrink significantly till
> only ceb is left.  Others that have been around a while such as Lars,
> Ralf, and Chris still post very regularly and have been with the project
> a long time (back to my previous stint even :).  I personally feel these
> guys are just as important to this project as anyone else.

I peek in from time to time. A could months ago I write a new core to a 
new ACL. I also wrote an XSLT template system which is now in use. I 
then spent a good month trying to find out if PEAR could be made to work 
for phpGW (it couldnt).

> As for why I'm coming back, skwashd spoke with me and pretty much told
> me that things that needed to get done could get done (within reason I'm
> sure ;-).  I had been wanting to beef up the database classes,
> schema_proc, and get the schema itself in shape.

Im very glad he dragged you back.

> In essense, it felt to me like the project has been more free recently
> than when I previously was intermittently contributing code.  I'd like
> to see more community ownership in phpGW than the past, as I feel
> contributors would gain great satisfaction from the feeling of owning
> the project.

It has been more free for a few reasons. 1) I have been away and felt 
that I shouldnt intervine with good work being done. 2) We switched to a 
core team from back when I was mostly a single leader. This opened up 
lots more to be done by the newly formed core team. 3) On the whole, the 
skills of the new dev team are better than the various contributors we 
had in the past.

> I understand where Dan is coming from in regards to ownership, but I
> don't agree with the stance on trademark and domain ownership or the
> veto.  If I were in the same position with my project (inactive
> contributions, others actively contributing) I would gladly assign those
> intangibles to the FSF.  Especially since it's a GNU project, they
> really should own tm, domain, and copyright.

As I have said, I will co-assign the domain if thats what everyone 
wants. I would assign administrative contact to be the FSF person who 
handles that stuff. I would stay as the technical and billing contacts.

As far as the trademark, I am going to keep it. Linus ownes the Linux 
trademark and wont budge as far as I understand. I know that I will be 
responsible with the trademark, and am not willing to give it up. If you 
all consider this irrational and think I cannot be trusted to be fair 
with it, I will live with that.

Dan