Re: [libreplanet-discuss] Is Stallman nuts?

[Leah Rowe]

Just put a filter in your mail client to move emails in this subject
line to /dev/null :P

On Sun, 15 Sep 2019 16:37:23 -0400 Betsy Garrett
<betsy.luebbe.garrett@gmail.com> wrote:

> I’m going to have to unsubscribe from this list until this discussion
> has run its course.
> 
> On Sun, Sep 15, 2019 at 4:32 PM TechLibre <nthomas@techlibre.net>
> wrote:
> 
> > My 17 year old can't go to the US Virgin Islands with out my
> > consent and neither did any of these young ladies without
> > parental/state actor's help.
> >
> > The consent issue and very poor to criminal parenting are
> > intertwined.
> >
> > In a society where Billy Ray helps Hanna Montana become Miley, I
> > guess we have to unravel that on an FSF thread by blaming Stallman
> > for raising exactly that issue.
> >
> > I have teenagers with 2 passports. I live in a country with 1
> > million brand new Venezuelan refugees.
> >
> > Trust me, the consent and law 'popular opinions' are the problem,
> > zero kids/girls/women will be pulled off the stroll in Lima Peru by
> > this mailing list.
> >
> > The same applies in Cambridge, Mass.
> >
> > The tragedy is, there's enough money and brain power on this list to
> > change hundreds of individual lives beyond FreeSoftware, but no
> > keyboards would be involved and you'd most certainly end up around
> > people who make you uncomfortable.
> >
> > I'm going to hold my record of fixing zero of Stallman's bugs, and
> > Epstein's look all done.
> >
> > There's this one bug though...where a young woman might think
> > getting on a plane with a rich guy for the weekend is a good idea
> > and her best option to make money.
> >
> > Damn I hate that bug.
> > --
> > Freesoftware is Agorism for people who are good at computer.
> >
> > On September 15, 2019 2:40:03 PM GMT-05:00, MARY-ANNE WOLF <
> > mgwmgw@comcast.net> wrote:
> > >Let me make sure that I understand the distinction that is being
> > >claimed here.  A young lady who is in fact young enough to be
> > >below the age of giving sexual consent "presents herself as being
> > >willing" to Epstein, an adult man aged over 21.  This happens with
> > >multiple underage girls on more than one occasion.
> > >
> > >So if Epstein has sex with each underage girl after she "presents
> > >herself as being willing", are you arguing that statutory rape has
> > >not occured?  If so, on what grounds?
> > >
> > >If it were one girl, we could debate whether Epstein believed that
> > >the young lady was older than was the case.  If we are talking
> > >about multiple underage girls, using an airplane named "The Lolita
> > >Express" that becomes much less plausible. I think we can assume
> > >he knew how young they were.
> > >
> > >So if a girl too young to give sexual consent tries to do so, and
> > >an adult male repeatedly acts as if he believes that she is old
> > >enough to give consent, does her action get him off the hook?  I
> > >do not think so. And if this happens with girl after girl after
> > >girl after girl? Really?
> > >
> > >If you believe that statutory rape did occur, then what does
> > >presenting herself as willing have to do with it?  Why bring that
> > >up?  Legally speaking, she was raped, no matter what she said
> > >first.
> > >
> > >So how is Stallman not trying to excuse statutory rape by what he
> > >posted?
> > >
> > >Mary-Anne
> > >
> > >
> > >> On September 15, 2019 at 2:46 PM Michael Downey
> > >> <michael@downey.net>
> > >wrote:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> I have not read the commentary articles, nor do I intend to. I
> > >> have,
> > >on the other hand, read the comments by the FSF President and Board
> > >member on the mailing list in question. They are entirely
> > >inappropriate comments for someone in his public position to be
> > >making.
> > >>
> > >> I spend my day job trying to convince large governments and
> > >> NGO's of
> > >the value of free software. Once again they see the FSF leader
> > >behaving inappropriately and I have to make excuses for him and
> > >the organization that continues to provide him safe harbor, and
> > >explain that they don't represent the values of the free software
> > >movement.
> > >>
> > >> I'm exhausted of doing that. The board has had many
> > >> opportunities to
> > >remove him from his role yet each time back down.
> > >>
> > >> As a single individual associate member, I can't do much. But I
> > >> can
> > >(and have) revoked my 15+ year membership and am removing all
> > >references to the FSF in materials from my day job. We just can't
> > >be associated with that kind of public behavior any more.
> > >>
> > >> The letter I sent to the FSF follows. I'll be unsubscribing from
> > >> this
> > >mailing list too, unfortunately, but encourage others to reconsider
> > >their support until the board acts in a way true to its public
> > >charter. For the sake of software freedom, I hope my absence is
> > >short-lived.
> > >>
> > >> - Michael
> > >>
> > >> FSF associate member #2352 (since 2004-05-20) here. I also
> > >> accepted
> > >the Free Software Award for Projects of Social Benefit several
> > >years ago.
> > >>
> > >> It’s unfortunate to hear yet another incident about the FSF
> > >President’s unacceptable behavior in the news again.
> > >>
> > >> Despite all the good things this organization does, this
> > >> continued
> > >behavior while holding the role makes it untenable for me to
> > >publicly support the FSF. And that’s a bad thing for software
> > >freedom.
> > >>
> > >> Software freedom is an important human right, but if one has to
> > >publicly trample others’ human rights in order to get there, one
> > >undermines one’s own cause.
> > >>
> > >> With his continued behavior over the years, Stallman has done
> > >> damage
> > >to our movement that will take a very long time to repair. It’s
> > >time for him to step down and let the next generation lead this
> > >critical movement into the future.
> > >>
> > >> Should he be unwilling to do so, I note that based upon my
> > >> review of
> > >the FSF bylaws, the Board has the power to remove the person in
> > >office of President with or without cause upon vote of the board.
> > >(Article VI, Section 7.)
> > >>
> > >> Until that time, I must regrettably cancel my associate
> > >> membership.
> > >>
> > >> /s/
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my
> > >> brevity. _______________________________________________
> > >> libreplanet-discuss mailing list
> > >> libreplanet-discuss@libreplanet.org
> > >> https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss
> > >
> > >_______________________________________________
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> > https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss
> 
> -- 
> 
> Sent from my mobile phone
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-- 
Leah Rowe <info@minifree.org>
Company Director & Libreboot developer
https://minifree.org/ https://libreboot.org/

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