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Re: mulle-objc #MakeObjCGreatAgain


From: Edwin Ancaer
Subject: Re: mulle-objc #MakeObjCGreatAgain
Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2016 06:40:24 +0100


First things first: I never contributed to GNUstep, and I probably never will: for 30 years I've been developping and analyzing  IBM-mainframe applications with exotic tools like Cobol, IMS, DB2, Rexx, JCL, so I do feel slightly uncomfortable in the PC-environment, as the prverbial Englishman in New York. But I ave this weird genetic predisposition that makes me like things like Smalltalk, NextStep, Objective-C, so I regularly keep coming back to this mailing list. So if your answer to a mail starts with 'Show me your contributions', you can just stop reading, and please accept my apologies for taking your time....


I like the idea: make objective c great again, as I fear that after Swift, Objective-C will remain as it is, frozen on version 2.0, and then completely be forgotten. And I think that's a pity, because the combination of Smalltalk and C just seems to make sense to me. High level if you can (Smalltalk), but low-level (C) when needed.
 
So what I would have liked to see at the mulle-objc website are some ideas and plans for the future evolution of Objective-C. Instead, I see the announcement of a runtime that currently seems to do no better than the current, working and tested, Etoile-Runtime, also based on Clang-LLVM, if I'm not mistaken. So I wonder, if there was no way to cooperate with the creators of the Etoile runtime, or is this runtime fundamentally flawed and beyond repair.

Imagine if, after some careful thought about possible improvements of objective-c, that coding effort  would have been spend on improving and extending, instead of just recreating.

Of course, I do not want to deny someone the right to create the software he wants, but as I see it, a lot of open source projects just seem unable to cooperate, and fuzz or split up over the slightest differences of opinion, looking like the Judean People's Front and the People's Front of Judea in the life of Brian.

Imagine if GNUstep and Cocotron had been able to combine their efforts, as they are (were?) largely doing the same thing( or so it seems to me).

Imagine that the time that will be spent on making gnustep running on the new runtime just could be spent on advancing the gnustep libraries....

And supporting all this might become even more impossible if your resources are limited:  I run on  Operating System X version Y (pck 1 of fifty) with compiler X version Y (pick 1 of 6) using runtime X version Y (pick 1 of 6).

All of this just to say I fear that having a new runtime might not be what is needed to save GNUstep
from oblivion. Now I will just start thinking about what I will do to save it.

Do you have any suggestions?

Edwin Ancaer 






2016-11-28 21:32 GMT+01:00 Lars Sonchocky-Helldorf <lars.sonchocky-helldorf@hamburg.de>:
Hi 'Steppers,


you might be interested in this: mulle-objc is a new way to run Objective-C code on various platforms, based on a new compiler and a new runtime.

https://mulle-objc.github.io

some more background information is available here:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13042199


regards,

        Lars
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