Re: LYNX-DEV why not use shift-V to access multiple bookmarks list?

[gregory j. rosmaita]

aloha, fote!

>       How are SELECT popups handled by speech synthesizers?  Do
> they read the current line that would be selected as you move up
> and down among the OPTIONs?

it depends upon the sophistication of the screen-reading software being
used, as well as the sophistication of the individual user...  my screen
reader (JAWS for DOS) will speek only the highlit information as i tab
from link to link on a page and will speak each individual option as i
move up and down among them with the arrow keys...

just a scant year ago, when i was using a 286 and a screen-reader of late
eighties vintage, this was not the case...  whenever i moved to a new link
(i should, perhaps, have pointed out that i have an alias defined for my
shell account that forces the -show_cursor option to be used anytime i
fire up lynx) it would force the synthesizer to read the entire line of
links, and whenever i scrolled up and down a select pop-up, it would read
the entire line (that is the text behind the pop-up selection box, as
well as the current option), which was not only confusing, but pretty damn
annoying...

someone--i believe it was bela or hiram--suggested not too long ago that,
given that the overwhelming preponderance of systems running lynx seem to
be using ancient versions of lynx, all of the  documentation at
lynx.browser.org and at the lynx enhanced pages should be encoded in HTML
2.0 to ensure compatability...  the same argument can be made for
screen-access programs--a decent screen-reader will set you back at least
four hundred and fifty clams, which is an appreciable ammount considering
that over 70 percent of all blind individuals in the US are unemployed,
and that that number is significantly higher worldwide...  therefore, just
as there are a hell of a lot of freenets and libraries out there which are
still using versions of lynx older than 2.3 beta, there are a tremendous
number of blind individuals using screen-access technology that is
primative by today's standards (DOS-based access actually didn't reach
its present level of sophistication until 1994)

couple this with the double-whammy facing those blind individuals whose 
only access to the 'net is via a rural freenet or who live in what we
americans like to euphemistcally refer to as "under-developed" 
nations/economies, and you have a convincing argument for keeping things
simple, clean, and elegant...

and isn't that the intrinsic appeal of lynx in the first place?  it is
streamlined, presents information in an elegant and extremely well
organized manner (thanks again, fote!), and is upgraded and debugged more
conscientiously than any other application i have ever encountered...

which is why i react so vehemently to suggestions that base-lynx (that
is, the "out of the box" version of lynx that even someone as ignorant of
the intricacies of UN*X as i am can compile using the zipped distribution)
should be endlessly tweaked to make it work (and even appear) more like
a "lite" graphics-free version of netslut or internet exploiter...  don't
get me wrong--i'm not in any way opposed to improvement--i merely think
that lynx-development _must_ keep the bottom-line, lowest-end user in
mind at all times...

lynx is the best browser out there precisely because it _is_ the most
efficient and expeditious means of exchanging information via the
world wide web...  and yet, from the end user's point of view, lynx's
achilles' heel is that the majority of lynx users are entirely dependent
upon their systems administrator to keep the version of lynx
available on his or her server current--and by current, i mean the
latest official release, not the latest patch...  many of the other blind
individuals with whom i am in contact use servers whose version of lynx is
older than 2.4.2, and whose sys admins callously turn a deaf ear to
continued pleas for upgrades...

i know that there are probably a few of you who wish i'd just shut up and
drop off the list, but i believe that it is essential that you, the
developers, are periodically reminded of the problems and obstacles--such as 
the inability to compile a personal copy of lynx, the inability of
many lynx users to run a local lynx.cfg file, the inability of some lynx
users to change the system's default options, etc.--that confront the
average user, as well as those that confront those of us who are
completely reliant on lynx as a means of crawling the web (and there is no
more apt metaphor than surfing with speech), lest lynx bloat into yet
another baroque browser...

and let me hasten to add that fote has done an excellent job of keeping
lynx simple, yet exponentially increasing its power with each release...

as for fote's second question:
>       What do braille interfaces do with that kind of thing?

i don't know--the nerve damage that caused my blindness also left me with
a severe neuropathy which makes it impossible for me to differentiate the
individual dots that comprise braille cells, so i don't use refreshable
braille myself, but i will forward fote's emessage to a few braille
display users and ask them to provide lynx-dev with feedback...

thank you for taking the time to read this,
gregory.
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