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Re: [gpsd-users] Problems with the gpsd website move

From: Ed W
Subject: Re: [gpsd-users] Problems with the gpsd website move
Date: Sun, 26 Feb 2012 20:51:07 +0000
User-agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.6; rv:10.0.2) Gecko/20120216 Thunderbird/10.0.2

On 26/02/2012 19:39, Eric S. Raymond wrote:
Ed W<address@hidden>:
I don't see why it's important that mailing lists are handled by the
same system that handles the source code?  Why not delegate mailing
lists to some other solution?
So devs don't have to manage multiple different sets of credentials.
The friction from this is constant and annoying.

Your counter argument is almost surreal.. Are you seriously saying that you would prefer a suboptimal solution for the things that you do every day, rather than create one new login to a service that you will probably only use very occasionally?

Probably I'm mis-understanding your concern because I think you must be worried about some aspect that I'm just not getting? Look, I will sketch out one possible solution below so that you can knock it down and show your concerns (otherwise I don't think I can contribute effectively to a solution if I don't see the piece which is bothering you). The snag with this approach is that you might think I'm over-committed to the suggestions here - please take the specifics as just an example

1) Github for sourcecode control, static hosting, wiki and issues
2) Either the status quo for mailing lists, or one of the big name alternatives. I'm going to chuck in Google groups as a suggestion here because it's controversial... 3) Use Lastpass for password management. For bonus marks get a Yubikey ( ) for very high security of your password database (and other things - they really are very cool for very little money)

You will need three security tokens for this.
a) SSH key for sourcecode checkin
b) Github login for management of web based things in github.
c) Google login for Google Groups

You clearly need a) for nearly all git solutions, so this is kind of a given.

Based on the usage numbers, b) is something that very large numbers of people already own - plenty more than nongnu logins for example. However, the distribution may be skewed in the case of your developer base. I think it's a non issue because in return for creating one more login token (which your browser can remember for you), you gain extremely powerful patch submission support. Users only need logins *if* they want to use github features, not to simply access the code, fork it or otherwise contribute.

Finally, most people already have a google login for some reason or another, so I guess that's easily sorted? I personally really hated Google Groups until either they changed their interface, or I worked it out... Firstly it *does* support +subscribe/+unsubscribe mail destinations so that arbitrary users can signup *without* themselves needing a google login. Secondly if you *do* have a google login and signup to the group that way, then it's still no problem to signup and have all your mail delivered to your preferred off-google mail account. So basically only the mail admins need a google login. I'm the admin for one group on Google Groups - so far I only needed to login once in about 4 years to do some maintenance...

All in all I really don't see that there are any significant problems caused by additional login tokens in any of the above? Users will need very few. Devs need only logins to very popular options. I believe the static pages on github can be managed through a git repo (which is neat and eases backups) - this eliminates one more tool/login for general tasks - oh and you can use a vanity domain name also:

It seems like you could migrate to github by:
- Download existing html site into your local src code directory
- Put html site under git version management
- Create new github page
- Git push the html up to github
- Git push the main src code up
- Setup issue tracking if you want it
- Err... apart from finessing the above, and setting up redirects, I think that's actually about it?

I personally really like the idea of managing nearly everything as a git repo! For my private projects I use gitolite, and at work we use git for deployment of code to webservers.

OK, so something about the above is not working for you. Can you describe so that I can (hopefully) help fix it? I get a sense that there is possibly just "fear of the unknown" here and in fact this type of setup could work very nicely for you?

All the best

Ed W

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