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RE: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23
From: |
Drew Adams |
Subject: |
RE: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23 |
Date: |
Sat, 15 Aug 2020 22:30:27 -0700 (PDT) |
> ISTR that we declared interactive-p obsolete because it is an not a
> correct solution to the problem it is meant to solve.
Then neither is (called-interactively-p 'interactive).
Goose ... gander.
> The correct solution is to give the function an optional argument
> and an interactive spec which provides a non-nil value for that argument
> in interactive calls.
I already do that where it makes sense (e.g. to
show a message). And that lesson is given in the
doc string of `called-interactively-p' (which is
_not_ obsolete, let alone being removed).
> There are cases where that gives the right answer,
> while interactive-p gives the wrong answer.
`called-interactively-p' is just as brittle as
`interactive-p' - see its doc string.
The main difference is for keyboard-macro use -
(called-interactively-p 'any) versus
(called-interactively-p 'interactive).
> The point is, you really should change each of those functions
> so that it will not misbehave in those special situations.
My code is backward-compatible, and there's too
much of it to want to change to
(if (fboundp 'called-interactively-p)
(called-interactively-p 'interactive)
(interactive-p))
I have no objection to Emacs having declared
`interactive-p' obsolete (well, I kinda do,
but not much, and it's not important at all).
I object to Emacs _removing_ it. I see no reason
for that. And no one has given a reason, so far.
Everything said against `interactive-p' so far is
true also of (called-interactively-p 'interactive).
Emacs allows the latter - it's not obsolete. Emacs
should continue to allow (interactive-p), which is
_identical_.
As far as I'm concerned, Emacs can feel free to
continue to call `interactive-p' names. Shout
from the rooftops that it's awful, evil, stupid,
obsolete, whatever. Doesn't bother me. What
bothers me is removing it. Sticks & stones...
I didn't complain about the other removals being
made, BTW.
I didn't complain that `buffer-menu-mode-hook' was
deprecated in favor of the same with capital `B',
or that the former is now being removed. Likewise,
for deprecating (and now removing)
`print-help-return-message' in favor of
`help-print-return-message'. Lots of obsolete
things are being removed now, with no complaint
from me, although I had to make code adjustments.
`interactive-p' is used much more than the others.
(Mea culpa: I said I had 2500 occurrences of
`interactive-p'. I actually have 406 occurrences.
A first grep included extraneous test files etc.)
Nothing is gained by removing `interactive-p'.
No one has been able to point out any gain. Only
pain, no gain.
- Re: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, (continued)
- Re: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Stefan Kangas, 2020/08/14
- RE: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Drew Adams, 2020/08/14
- Re: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Ulrich Mueller, 2020/08/14
- RE: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Stefan Kangas, 2020/08/15
- RE: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Drew Adams, 2020/08/15
- Re: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Stefan Monnier, 2020/08/15
- RE: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Drew Adams, 2020/08/15
- Re: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Richard Stallman, 2020/08/16
- RE: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23,
Drew Adams <=
- Re: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Stefan Monnier, 2020/08/16
- Re: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Richard Stallman, 2020/08/16
- RE: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Drew Adams, 2020/08/17
- RE: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Gregory Heytings, 2020/08/17
- Re: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Jeff Norden, 2020/08/17
- Re: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Eli Zaretskii, 2020/08/18
- RE: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Drew Adams, 2020/08/18
- Re: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Stefan Monnier, 2020/08/18
- RE: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Drew Adams, 2020/08/18
- Re: Delete variables obsolete since Emacs 23, Gregory Heytings, 2020/08/18