Re: User interface, TeXmacs and Axiom (was: Re: [Axiom-developer] backups)

[Ralf Hemmecke]

On 04/13/2006 02:35 PM, David MENTRE wrote:
> 2006/4/13, Ralf Hemmecke <address@hidden>:
> > But you cannot expect someone to implement something in a not-so-robust
> > system which doesn't let you track bugs easily.
>
> In a short summary, what would you like to have?

Hmm, actually, I cannot speak much about Axiom, but whether it's Aldor 
or Axiom doesn't matter that much. I am missing a debugger that let's 
you run a program step by step and shows the corresponding source code 
in an editor like window. All newer IDEs have this feature.

Yes I know that one should rather think before one programs and I also 
like the work of Christian Aistleitner quite a lot

http://www.risc.uni-linz.ac.at/software/aldor/aldorunit

But sometimes it's also quite useful if you can comfortably step through 
your code, showing variables and everything.

Well and for Aldor the biggest problem is that the compiler is buggy. 
One never knows whether the bug is in your own source or in the 
compiler. There is definitely need for improvement.

For Axiom I remember that it sometimes showes strange error messages or 
suggests that you should debug in BOOT. A user should actually never see 
anything else than Aldor/SPAD. When I started with Axiom, I was always 
disappointed when I saw the BOOT prompt. And even though I know some 
lisp, that frightens me if I want to do Algebra and I end up in LISP.

I hope it was short enough. Hmmm, I think I should add something to the 
Axiom WishList. ;-)

> > I am not only speaking of Axiom, but there is definitely need for a
>> better user interface.

> I agree, even if the current text interface is not that bad.

But Axiom does not yet have something like a worksheet format. That was 
the reason why I referred to Texmacs.

We might end up in getting an interface to write live pamphlet files. 
But I guess, that is a bit tricky, since all the <<...>> chunks are 
somehow like macros and thus the code does not need to appear in the 
order you write.

> Do not forget that somebody is working on a web interface (with Tim?).

Can I already see something that works? Or is that still unfinished?
I cannot remember that I heard a release announcement.

> > Although I am not yet a big fan of Texmacs, because it is yet another
> > language (besides LaTeX) to learn, I somehow think that it should become
> > a more integrated into axiom and become the default userinterface.

> I like TeXmacs *but* it has some big issues for me, one of the biggest
> being it is quite slow (the interface is not snappy enough).

Well, yes, that TeXmacs is slow also disturbed me quite a lot, but Axiom 
needs to have something comparable to M&M for it's interface.

You could say, that AxiomWiki is something like a worksheet format, but 
it is a bit inconvenient to work with, if you always have to press the 
edit button.

Ralf