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Re: Using Emacs for business

From: Emanuel Berg
Subject: Re: Using Emacs for business
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 2021 05:22:52 +0200
User-agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux)

Jean Louis wrote:

> Python does not have nice ready made interface like Emacs
> has.

Python is a _programming language_, Emacs, among other things,
a _text editor_.

> Editing is integral part of the work. I have been doing the
> same work outside of Emacs and have been using HTTP
> interface where nice editing is almost impossible.

... ?

The built-in mode for Python:

Much more:

> One has to use browser text fields, eventually extensions to
> edit objects.

... :)

See this simple IRC bot, written in Python, using ONLY Emacs:

> I have been using console and launching any editor and I can
> say that is more tedious than having Emacs run the program
> and launch editing of values or objects. Emacs offers ready
> made GUI that may be used by programmers, for example:


> - various nice and handy input functions are there,
>   completing-read and similar;
>   Is there equivalent in Python for following in 2 lines?
>   (let ((collection '("one" "two" "thre")))
>     (completing-read "Choice: " collection))

A language war, and I'm pro-Python against Lisp... :))

I like Lisp much more. But Python has a much stronger grip
everywhere, almost. Lisp is an underground/elite thing.
But not elite as in big bucks I'm afraid. You can go ask
people working with computers to make money everywhere, but
also young, ambitious people who study CS around the world at
the universities. All of them will have some experience from
Python, almost, but only a few (of the university guys) will
be Lispers.

It wasn't always like this, Lisp had a much stronger following
in the "old" computer world when universities were much
stronger players, there were even "Lisp Wars" between
dialects. But now other languages, Python for example, are
much stronger, including at the universities.

I can't say I like Python but development _is_ very quick and
there are just so many people doing it almost any issue you
come across you get tons of good hits when you google even
issues you yourself thought to be rare/exotic. Try do the same
with Lisp :) Oh, no, that's why it is a secluded company these
days, rather. There is just so many books, webpages,
communities around Python, it is a no contest compared with
what we have with Lisp.

Tell the little guys running the "greedy" little computer
business world - compared to big business, which is 100%
altruistic, of course - well, you might tell them bosses as
well actually just as well - a lot of these guys have never
HEARD of Lisp!

> - various completing and selection packages like helm, ivy,
>   are there making the work so much easier with automatic
>   improvements; those work straight and automatic, is there
>   such equivalent in Python? Like just load a library and
>   start choosing visually and easy?

Just Google Helm or Ivy plus Python, there should be tons.
Do you think Emacs only works for Lisp?

> - tabulated-list-mode -- good reporting interface, is there
>   Python or other language equivalent? I wish if it would
>   be, I would like it so. Idea and implementation of it in
>   Emacs is fantastic.
> - easy key binding configurations? 
> - easy menu generation, any equivalents?
> - opening new GUI windows, closing, splitting?
> I would like to implement same programs in other languags
> but the above are major obstacles which demand programming
> from scratch.

You can use Emacs for not only Python and Elisp but zsh, C++,
Ada, the SQLs, Erlang, SML, the other Lisps, Haskell, Java,
all web layout/programming, C, etc etc etc, even really rare
things like Microsoft's dafny (to do formal verification on
the fly) has a mode somewhere in the MELPAs, I remember...

> Features in Emacs on the other hand allow easy and
> rapid development.
> Helm or ivy or other completing packages for example help in
> creating easy invoice, receipts or supermarket management
> sotware. Find a product rapidly, add to list, print invoice,
> add to database.
> There is fat overhead in other languages without integrated GUI
> like Emacs editor.

Get real ...

underground experts united

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