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RE: [h-e-w] EmacsW32, gnuserv, pathes in .emacs


From: Drew Adams
Subject: RE: [h-e-w] EmacsW32, gnuserv, pathes in .emacs
Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2006 22:43:03 -0700

    > Perhaps a modular suite of short (mini) tutorials? That is,
    > a long tutorial could be tackled more easily in several
    > learning sessions and in smaller bites. You could go
    > directly to "Lesson 3, Incremental Search" or whatever,
    > if you wanted. With an outline at the top (or left) that
    > helps you find your way around the main tutorial topics,
    > that could be an improvement.

    There's nothing in the current tutorial that prevents users
    from reading it in chunks.  The Tutorial is divided into
    sections, so a user could leave after reading some of them,
    then return to where she left off.

Sorry. As I said, it's been 20 years since I used the tutorial.

If it's easy to reenter and pick up where you left off, easy to explore or
not explore different branches, and branches are easily recognized
(identified), then I don't see why anyone would complain about it being
long. In that case, it's only as long as you follow it.

    The important thing is that new users should read the Tutorial
    in its entirety (but not necessarily in one go), because
    otherwise they will lack important information.  I don't know
    how to force people to do that.

Not necessarily in one go - yes! And yes, I'm sure that everything there is
useful.

    While adding some menu or tree-like structure to the Tutorial
    is a good idea, it still cannot solve the problem of people
    who are too impatient to finish their reading before they
    start working.

Correct. There's nothing to be done with the impatient. That's OK. Let them
play - they'll discover it all soon enough. (Though they might try *our*
patience with impetuous questions...)

    It is okay to skip the Tutorial, but then the user should
    invest lots of time reading the manual (which does have
    structure).

The (excellent) manual is more of a reference manual than a user guide. I do
agree that everyone (including Theuser) would do well to invest lots of time
in it - it's a mine of interesting stuff. Print it out and park it next to
the toilet or your bed - read something new each day. By the time you will
have finished the last page, Emacs 22 will be out, and you can print a new
edition... This is what life is all about - Zippy knew that. It doesn't get
any better than this.

It's also good to have something like a tutorial that holds you by the hand
and guides you. People learn in different ways. A tutorial can help many
people. I'm sure we all agree on this.

    > In general, anything we think Emacs users need to use often
    > should be at least pointed out in the tutorial.

    That would make the Tutorial impossibly long.  There's too
    much to tell.

It would be impossibly long only if you stick to the idea that "new users
should read the Tutorial in its entirety."  An expanded tutorial that points
out the most important areas to explore first would no longer fit that
strict prescription. Such an expanded tutorial would be a superset of the
current tutorial, in terms of content. It would be an Adventure game with
many more caves and rooms, that's all.

The key requirement would be to somehow point out clearly which are the
things you really should learn first - distinguishing those from other
interesting things to learn, which are not so essential. Make it clear to
users - label the routes (like ski slopes?).

    > The emphasis in the tutorial (IIRC - it's
    > been twenty years since I've used it) is on text editing,
    > which is fine, but how to get help and how to customize
    > Emacs (that is, how to set preferences)
    > are also important for general use.

    The philosophy is that the default Emacs should
    work well enough for the new user not to be
    bothered by customization for quite some time.

It's not a question of bother. Setting preferences in most UI applications
is not something users do only exceptionally and only because they are
bothered. This is all the more true of Emacs customization. Customization is
a part of normal Emacs use even more than it is part of the use of other
apps. Emacs *is* customization, in oh so many ways. Do you want to
customize? Get Emacs. It doesn't matter what - you can customize anything
with Emacs.

If you're not customizing, then you are not emacsing. You may be editing,
you may be writing code, you may be reading mail, but you're not emacsing -
until you customize. Sorry, but that's a law of nature.

I have never, ever, ever seen anyone use Emacs as is, out of the box. Do you
use only emacs -q? I'd be willing to bet on that one.

That doesn't mean that Emacs isn't adequate out of the box. It's not missing
any screws. The Emacs package you get with the distribution is the best
Emacs package to distribute: it is the lowest common denominator, in many
ways, but it also represents wise design choices, including UI choices. But
people like to tinker, and they have different tastes, including bad taste
sometimes. Nothing to be done...

Have you ever seen people discussing a UI - no matter what it is? They never
agree about anything. One wants the text larger, the other smaller. One
wants dark on light for readability; the other wants neon on black with
metalic borders and heavy metal surround-sound.

Customization is *not* about "bother"; it's about individual preference -
look & feel. You like a small dog; I like a large dog; that guy likes a
watchdog. Customized UIs are like dogs: there are 80 frillion kinds of dog
because people just like different things.

Look at the multitudes who customize their cars, be it subtly or garrishly.
Look at the zillions of people, even in far-flung villages in the mountains
of Asia, who dress up their cell phones with all kinds of fancy doo-dads.
Look at the untold masses who download themes, wallpaper, screensavers, and
such for their desktops.

Think of skins - who thinks that skins are about "bother"?  [the philosophy
is that the default should work well enough for the new user not to be
bothered by the need for a skin for quite some time  - huh?]

People like to play and make themselves at home in an application -
especially one like Emacs. Customization is *not* about "bother"; it is
about nesting.

Honestly, we're gonna have to send you back for regrooving, Eli - make you
sit through the 6000-node tutorial on "Preferences, What They're All About",
and then write an essay on "How I Learned to Love Preferences". If you
prefer, you can sit through an animated PowerPoint presentation on "I
Prefer, You Prefer, We All Prefer". But if you _prefer_ either that or the
tutorial, then, well, you're already on the road to recovery.

    If that is far from reality, let's hear why.  Perhaps some
    defaults need to be changed, or perhaps Emacs should do
    something automatically that it doesn't.

    > I suspect the problem is not the overall size, but the fact
    > that it is not in bite-size pieces - you need to digest it
    > all at once. You cannot easily follow the tutorial for 10
    > minutes each day - you cannot easily pick up
    > where you left off.

    I don't see why this would be impossible.  Please explain.

My bad, no doubt. Bad memory, in particular.






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