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Re: Need more detail.

From: Derek A. Neighbors
Subject: Re: Need more detail.
Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2000 19:59:53 -0700

I will try quick response.  Andrew, Jade, James please chime in...

> Things have probably advanced from what's on the documentation on

Yes docs need work. 
> 1) are we using static or DII CORBA

Not sure I understand the question wholly.

> 2) is the db factory class working? per Object Server Guide Proposal
> (OSGP from here)

Andrew can answer this.

> 3) are we still using ORBit (if so, I would guess it generates skels and
> stubs for python!?)

Yes using ORBit.  But you shouldnt have to create IDL.  ObjectServer
handles this.

> 4) now I have my UML model. I write the IDL compileit in ORBit and get
> some python code for the Object Server. What now? I guess I instance a
> DB Object and I should be able to intialize my object container (i.e.
> create the table to hold the objects of each of my classes). So there
> should be some common methods defined for this in the DB Object. Are
> there?

You write NO IDL.  (This was whole frustation in RR discussion!)  You
dont have to worry about all this stuff.  That is what GNUe is ALL
about. :)  You just focus on biz rules and stuff and dont worry about
nasty IDL's and database handling etc...

> 5) cool. I've now got my containers. and I just sit there and wait for
> client requests to invoke my methods?

see above.

> 6) are my biz objects part of a more complex system. I mean, are there
> any common services (i've seen some ideas here and there in the OSGP),
> like for startup and shutdown, do we register our modules somewhere,
> etc...

at this point we arent going there quite yet but i think we will see
things like this.  though this somewhat happens...

> 7) are there any common methods defined for client interaction?

see all above.  all methods can be used by any client really. thats the
idea of re usable biz logic. :)
> I think you see where I'm getting at.

yes and thinking document needs MUCH updating to explain this. :)
> Can someone PLEASE gimme a brief for-dummies-kind-a-thingy, on how all
> this will (or is working) works. Like a step by step thing something
> like:
> 1) write your IDL
> 2) compile in Orbit
> 3) add your implementation details, SQL, using ???? for DB access and
> methods.
> 4) you must implement the following self-creating methods: a), b),c)
> ...
> etc...

1. write your uml
2. write a .cld (similar to IDL only simple) <-- i am thinking a plugin
to dia to generate .cld's would be easy.  maybe worth looking at.
3. there is a program that will create your tables off this .cld (though
you could do by hand if you so desire)
4. write the logic of your methods in python
5. create form(s) (tool to do this off your table exists)
6. add triggers to form to make use of business rules
7. use your application 

There might be some more steps but this is about how I am seeing it.

> If this stuff is not defined yet I would REALLY like to make it happen
> NOW.
> I'm tired of reading this will be, it should have, etc.. I really want
> to see my thing work!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> I mean we can use my impetu w/ inventory to make a working example of
> all three tiers working toghether (components, biz objects, RDBMS), even
> if I have to make some stuff up on the way. Just to proof of concept.

It works already. :)  Has for a few weeks.  As a two tier product.  For
last week all three tiers work.  Just missing some more advanced
features.  We have working apps with this stuff.  We just arent
screaming this to the whole world just yet as we want to iron out some
kinks before the masses come.  We plan to release v0.1.0 VERY soon and
publish to the world.... i.e. freshmeat etc...
> I find many things in our docs are vague and virtual (except GDA
> hacker's guide from what I've seen). I am most probably stupid but I
> still don't understand how GDA fit's in the picture! Are our biz objects
> supposed to talk to GDA to get DB Access. Then what's the DB Object in
> the OSGP for? or is the DB Object going to talk w/ GDA or GEDI or
> whatever?

No GEAS will handle this.  GDA hackers guide is really only for people
working on GDA and not for application developers.  I know documentation
is a MAJOR problem.  I have put "end user" or application developer
documentation to the top of my list!!! I PROMISE!!!!!!!
> As you can all see I'm very confused and the more I read the more
> confused I become :-(

Thank you for pointing this out.  It helps us get off our butts and get
our message out!!! You see its very discouraging to write docs when the
only people actively using are the 5 or 6 actively developing it. :) 
Now that we have some interest elsewhere we better get off our butts and
communicate. :)

Derek Neighbors
GNU Enterprise

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