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Re: [Pan-users] Are kill-filed messages shown as non read messages?
From: |
Duncan |
Subject: |
Re: [Pan-users] Are kill-filed messages shown as non read messages? |
Date: |
Tue, 10 Jul 2012 23:11:04 +0000 (UTC) |
User-agent: |
Pan/0.139 (Sexual Chocolate; GIT bf56508 /usr/src/portage/src/egit-src/pan2) |
Bob posted on Tue, 10 Jul 2012 18:24:15 +0000 as excerpted:
> On Wed, 11 Jul 2012 02:54:33 +1000, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>
>> Bob wrote:
>>> On Wed, 11 Jul 2012 02:09:12 +1000, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>>>
>>>> Bob wrote:
>>>>> Was going through my groups this morning and noticed no recent
>>>>> activity in this group, so I marked all as read, and then marked all
>>>>> threads as read.
>>>>>
>>>>> I moved to another group to do the same, and noticed that I still
>>>>> had 58 messages marked as unread in the group I had just marked as
>>>>> all read.
>>>>
>>>> If they're kill-filed, they're hardly read, are they?
>>>
>>> No, they aren't read, but they then should not show up if they are
>>> killed as they are not available for reading.
>> View:Header Pane menu, you will see the very last entry is "Match
>> scores of -9999 (ignored)".
> That helps greatly.
For people not using stale distributions' old pan, and I see in the
headers you're upto date with "Sexual Chocolate" (0.139) but this was
added in ... well I don't have pan's git repo checked out to build ATM so
I can't check the changelog, but I'd say 0.136 or 0.137 or so...
What you're looking for is pan prefs, actions tab. =:^)
There you can configure pan for "automatic actions" based on score. It's
possible, for instance, to mark watched posts auto-download or auto-cache
(depending on how you use pan, auto-download would be for binary users
that download-and-save directly, auto-cache for text users and binary
users that set big caches, download to cache, and /then/ go thru it),
negative-scored posts to auto-mark-read, and ignored posts to auto-delete.
That nicely eliminates the ignored-posts-still-show-as-unread problem!
=:^)
If the feature had been introduced with the pan rewrite (0.90) or when
pan first got scoring (0.14.x or earlier), it may well have been enabled
by default with actions and score-levels described above, as they do sort
of make sense. But as it's a relatively new feature introduced to an
otherwise reasonably mature software product, that might have been an
unwelcome surprise to upgraders who handled things differently, so the
safe alternative was to leave all actions disabled by default, until
enabled by the user at the level they wanted. Of course that means some
people don't realize it's there and end up doing manually what pan can
handle for them automatically, but...
Meanwhile, long-time pan users are used to doing it as described upthread,
set match on ignored as well, then where there's lots of ignored posts,
unthread and sort by score so all ignored posts are grouped, then select
and mark-read/delete as desired.
Another alternative, tho problematic for people like me that sometimes
leave a few posts deliberately marked unread to come back to later, is to
use the mark-group-read function, either manually, or set the pan
preference to mark groups read on exit. I suspect that's what a lot of
folks do. But there's a technical issue with this that occasionally
catches people too. When this option is used, pan marks read everything
upto the current high-water-mark[1], so on servers where posts don't
necessarily appear in assigned sequential number order, this can cause
pan to miss the out-of-order-numbered posts that appear later.
So marking only the ones actually seen is the most reliable method, but
before the automated-actions feature, it either had to be done manually,
or the easier but less reliable method could be used, or I suppose some
people just ignored the unread number.
So the automated-actions feature is really cool in this regard. =:^)
But it's still new and I'm not sure that many people use it yet, so it's
possibly still buggy in corner-cases. So if you use it and see it doing
something you don't expect, please post. It may be that your idea of
what it should be doing doesn't match Heinrich's (he's the one that
programmed it based on my description of the feature as discussed for
years but never implemented) and/or mine, or it may be a bug. But the
only way to find out is to post a question about it if it happens, and
see.
---
[1] In nntp, a server numbers posts in a group in sequence, and a group
request will return the lowest unexpired number, called the low water
mark, and highest assigned number, the high water mark, along with an
/estimate/ of the number of posts available. (Some may be spam-filtered
or canceled after numbering so number available may be less than high
minus low.) But on systems where an intake server does the numbering
before the posts are sent to the user-visible server, the posts may
arrive in an order other than the sequential number order, thus the
problem if a client assumes nothing else will come in below the current
high-water-mark.
--
Duncan - List replies preferred. No HTML msgs.
"Every nonfree program has a lord, a master --
and if you use the program, he is your master." Richard Stallman
Re: [Pan-users] Are kill-filed messages shown as non read messages?, Bob, 2012/07/10