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Re: Spam on info-cvs list.

From: Greg A. Woods
Subject: Re: Spam on info-cvs list.
Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 12:32:31 -0500 (EST)

[ On Monday, January 14, 2002 at 22:51:23 (-0800), Wim Kerkhoff wrote: ]
> Subject: Re: Spam on info-cvs list.
> I'm not to sure how affective RBL lists are

I am very sure of exactly how effective the RBLs are at blocking spam.
I've checked all the spams to this list in the normal course of checking
all the spam I receive.

> -- some of the valid
> messages on this list are going through relays that are RBL'd.

I'm not so sure about that, at least not with the specific RBLs I've
mentioned.  I've not been nearly so diligent in checking valid on-topic
messages to the list though, which is why I can't be so sure.

In any case this concern is entirely irrelevant.  Any legitimate post
rejected by the list can be either re-directed through some other
unblocked relay by the poster, or even forwarded to the list manager(s)
for manually approved forwarding.

> Now, that
> sucks -- both for the poster how may be asking a valid question, or
> somebody who's waiting for an answer... its not the user's fault that
> some ISP somewhere is black listed.

Users choose the Intenet community they join.  If you get in with a
bunch of spammers then you get what they get.  :-)  ISPs who allow
spammers to use their networks threaten all of their customers, not just
the bad ones (and thus hopefully threaten their entire business, though
the effectiveness of the latter threat is for their other customers to
decide of course).

In any case the way a user decides to forward their e-mail is something
that's literally _always_ possible to change, no matter what any user's
connectivity choices are.  With the availability of SMTP AUTH it's now
possible to securely allow any authorised client to relay messages
through any appropriately configured mail server anywhere on the Internet.

Furthermore remember that RBLs and other such blocking and filtering
mechanisms are just an alternative to restricting the list to
subscribers only.  With subscriber-only posting restrictions the 

> Spam is one of the things I hate, but I just learn to cope with (hit
> 'd'!) and ignore.  Most people don't have time or a desire to do
> anything more.

I don't mind too much having to configure my own mailer to deflect
direct spam sent to it, but I do mind very much when spammers are
allowed to use widely distributed mailing lists that I happen to
subscribe to since that makes it impossible for me to employ some of the
most effective mechanisms I know of to reject those spams.

This is the very last mailing list at that I subscribe to (where
once I subscribed to, and actively participated in, at least a half
dozen or so), and I may not stay here much longer.  With several spams a
day coming from it, and with the amount of spams I receive from other
sources steadily falling in number, this list is becoming significantly
annoying.  I know I'm very much not alone in having to unsubscribe from
poorly managed lists because of the spam floods.

I would gladly host the list distribution myself, though I'm not willing
or able to serve as the list manager, nor would I be willing or able to
operate any part of any mail-to-news gateway.

                                                                Greg A. Woods

+1 416 218-0098;  <address@hidden>;  <address@hidden>;  <address@hidden>
Planix, Inc. <address@hidden>; VE3TCP; Secrets of the Weird <address@hidden>

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