Re: New Emacs with GTK!

[Michael Powe]

>>>>> "Niels" == Niels Freimann <nfreimann@firemail.de> writes:

    >> actually, i doubt it.  i'm sure that there are many who, like
    >> me, do the bulk of their editing in -- gasp -- the console.
    >> gtk will be worthless to us

    Niels> emacs was introduced to me in the early 90th by a person
    Niels> who belongs to the developers. What he installed on my
    Niels> machine was X11 emacs.  I never saw anybody editing in the
    Niels> console seriousely.  Therefore I don't believe that too
    Niels> many of people do editing in the console.  This people may
    Niels> use zile or something.

    Niels> I fully subscribe to Miles saying that "I expect that once
    Niels> the GTK version hits prime-time, it will get a lot more
    Niels> maintenance attention than the other versions "

    Niels> Furthermore I expect that, when the GTKversion hits
    Niels> prime-time, the developers will remove all the
    Niels> anachronistic xlib and motif code for the reason of a much
    Niels> slimmer code which will be much more open to the community
    Niels> for maintenance.

since a few people replied by mail to my comments, let me summarize my
responses.  

how many versions of unix include gtk libraries?  i suspect the answer
is 'none,' but someone can apprise me if i'm wrong.  i know they are
not on solaris 8, openbsd 2.7 or sunos 4.1 because i have those.  i'd
be very surprised if they were on freebsd, just because they are gpl.
therefore, restricting emacs to gtk means restricting its use to linux
users who use gnome.  not likely.

this is not a hot-button issue for me, but obviously it is for some
others.  the chances that i would ever compile gtk-emacs are near
zero.(although, the other day, i compiled and installed xemacs; used
it once.  so, anything is possible when i'm bored. ;-) everybody else
is free to do as they please.  this does remind me somewhat of the
religious wars between xemacs and gnu emacs of some years back.

i personally do not give a rip about "themes," or how "pretty" my
editor is.  emacs is a tool and a damned good one.  i use it because
it does everything i want an editor to do.  whether i'm in the
console, as now, or in x, as i was yesterday, my primary concern is
that my tools function well. (the reason i use xfce rather than
gnome.)  everyone has their sources of amusement.  some people fool
around with their desktop.  i watch chess on the chess server.  but,
at least i'm not confused that fics is somehow a necessity of life.
nor do i think that everybody should be REQUIRED to watch chess on
fics and not on ics or some other server.

as for the comment about how "nobody works in the console," well,
probably nearly everyone who, like me, works remotely, DOES use the
console.  when i'm working on a web site, i can edit and create files
directly on site because -- shock, horror -- i can use emacs in a
terminal.  since i routinely work on shell connections to solaris and
linux boxes, being able to work comfortably in the terminal is a job
requirement. (yes, i also can work comfortably with vi.)  when i'm
travelling, i ssh home for both work and mail.  most of the time, x
forwarding is impossible or impractical, even if i wanted to waste
time with it.  i seriously doubt that i am an isolated case in this
regard.

i think perhaps some people are prone to think that the whole world
is, or should be, just like them and their friends.  it's not.  it
shouldn't be.

for me, personally, the editor of choice is and probably always will
be GNU Emacs, God's Own Editor(tm).  whatever choices rms makes about
its future will be fine with me.  i trust him.  i just don't happen to
think he's going to limit it to gtk users.

from the console,
mp

-- 
  Michael Powe                                 Waterbury, CT USA
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"It stands to reason that self-righteous, inflexible, single-minded,
authoritarian true believers are politically organized. Open-minded,
flexible, complex, ambiguous, anti-authoritarian people would just as
soon be left to mind their own fucking business." - R.U. Sirius